Author Topic: ESPIER  (Read 723 times)

les303

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ESPIER
« on: May 06, 2021, 11:46:18 AM »
From Wednesday's challenge game - espier ( one that espies ) came up as not known?

Alan W

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Re: ESPIER
« Reply #1 on: May 20, 2021, 05:02:56 PM »
Espier is in some dictionaries, including Merriam-Webster and Collins.

No dictionary seems to label it as archaic, which surprises me, given how hard it is to find any recent usage examples. Recent, as in this century or the last. The most recent citation in the OED is from Richard Burton's 1885 translation of the Arabian Nights, which deliberately uses a style described as pseudo-archaic:

Quote
Then we entered the city and found all who therein woned into black stones enstoned: not an inhabited house appeared to the espier, nor was there a blower of fire.

Creeping into the 20th century, we find Long Will, 1903, by Florence Converse, set in the 14th century:

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"There be espiers set in every lane and the highway," said the alewife. "They'll give warning."

The only example I could find from within my own lifetime was from the 1963 SF novel The Men in the Walls, by William Tenn:

Quote
And as a man you will no longer be Eric the Only, you will be Eric the Eye. Eric the Eye, Eric the Espier, Eric who seeks out the path for Mankind. Eric who hits back at the Monsters with his eye, his open eye, his electric eye, his further-seeing, clearer-seeing, less-paying eye.

Espier will be allowed, but definitely as a rare word.
Alan Walker
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les303

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Re: ESPIER
« Reply #2 on: May 22, 2021, 01:20:13 PM »
Thanks Alan.

This is not a serious word suggestion, just an observation ;
I guessed moyle in Thursday's standard game.
As it was a guess, i clicked on the word to see the definition.
Alternative form of both moil & moile.
moile ---- a kind of high shoe worn in ancient times.
I had already played moil so i tried moile, expecting it to come up as rare but it was unknown?
Similarly, in yesterdays 7 by many game, i guessed sosses.
1. plural form of soss
2. spurious plural form of sossos
sossos was " sorry not known "

ridethetalk

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Re: ESPIER
« Reply #3 on: May 26, 2021, 10:54:11 PM »
Thanks Alan.

This is not a serious word suggestion, just an observation ;
I guessed moyle in Thursday's standard game.
As it was a guess, i clicked on the word to see the definition.
Alternative form of both moil & moile.
moile ---- a kind of high shoe worn in ancient times.
I had already played moil so i tried moile, expecting it to come up as rare but it was unknown?
Similarly, in yesterdays 7 by many game, i guessed sosses.
1. plural form of soss
2. spurious plural form of sossos
sossos was " sorry not known "

It's not unusual to be gifted words that were hitherto unknown to me by checking the meaning of words!  ;D
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les303

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Re: ESPIER
« Reply #4 on: June 06, 2021, 05:09:14 PM »
I play chi for many reasons, it provides multiple benefits, but the main reason that i play so regularly is simply because i enjoy it.

One of those almost hidden benefits is the way that it has, ever so subtly, managed to increase my very limited vocabulary.
So when i come across a " new " word i will usually click on the word meaning tab.
I find that this sometimes helps me to remember the word for future games & as you point out John, there can often be the bonus of gaining a " free " word in the wiktionary references.
I see that you have come across another example with reism

This does not happen very often & is no big deal but i would appreciate it Alan if you could take the time to "please explain" why this sometimes occurs where words referenced in the word meaning are unknown to chi?

Alan W

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Re: ESPIER
« Reply #5 on: June 07, 2021, 04:14:40 PM »
The general answer to your question, Les, is that different dictionaries contain different collections of words. Obviously the great majority of words in any given dictionary will be found in any other dictionary of a similar size. But some of the very rarest words may be found in only one dictionary (or in none). There is no such thing as an agreed list of all the words in the English language.

The word list Chi started with, in 2005, had been compiled by other people, from various dictionaries, not including Wiktionary, which didn't exist in those days. At least half the words accepted by Chi are rare enough to be complete mysteries to me, but I would never claim that all possible words are included. If I thought that, there would be no point inviting people to submit suggestions. So far this year over 50 new words have been added. In the history of Chi around 1400 words have been added. So obviously the word list is a work in progress.

There are at least two words written as reist:

  • the word relating to the philosophical concept reism, presumably pronounced with two syllables, as ree-ist, or ray-ist;
  • an alternate spelling of reest, with several meanings, presumably pronounced with one syllable, to rhyme with beast.

The former word, along with reism, appears in Wiktionary, but in no other general dictionary as far as I can see. The second word is found in the online Merriam-Webster and Oxford dictionaries, but not in Wiktionary. Some of the meanings of reest are verbs - to cure fish or meat; (of a horse, etc) to stop suddenly - so reisted and reisting would also be words. And, indeed, reisted and reisting are accepted in Chi. And so are reest, reested and reesting.

In due course I'll consider ridethetalk's implied suggestion that reism be accepted.
Alan Walker
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les303

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Re: ESPIER
« Reply #6 on: June 07, 2021, 04:24:19 PM »
Thanks Alan, i appreciate you taking the time to provide that very clear explanation.